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> Your Writing Process, And/Or Problems with Same
SubRosa
post Aug 15 2011, 05:06 PM
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QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Aug 15 2011, 10:45 AM) *

Edit: Oh, one more thing. When you guys write stories, do you update your story by going along and adding new scenarios, or do you already have it all written down and just post regularly?


Some people write a segment, then post it, and then start writing the next segment, etc... Some people write an entire story from start to finish before posting. And finally some like me are in the middle, and write an entire chapter (say 10,000 words perhaps), and chop it up into individual posts of 2-3k words each. Then they make a post every two or three days until it is all up. I now keep a posting schedule of twice a week, on Mondays and Thursdays. Acadian posts once a week, on Fridays. The chapter I currently have in the can will take six posts, so I should have it all up by the end of next week. In the meantime I am now writing the next chapter. So hopefully that will be done by the time I finish posting the current one.

This post has been edited by SubRosa: Aug 15 2011, 05:07 PM


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Kazaera
post Aug 15 2011, 07:44 PM
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I second everything SubRosa says about characters, and will add that it's also important to have the characters *around* your main characters come across as real and believable, even if you have much less space to flesh them out - all the main-character-development in the world is going to fall flat if it seems like the world around them is full of cardboard cut-outs who revolve only around the MC. The best plot, IMHO, is one that arises naturally from your different characters and their ambitions and goals, and there's little I dislike more than reading a story where it feels like the characters are being bent to follow the plot than the other way around.

As far as writing goes, I figure it depends on how you write? For instance, if you know you can churn out, say, 3-4k words of story every week with only rare exceptions, then posting as soon as you finish writing is doable. However, my writing is far more erratic than that, so I need a buffer. Another danger of posting as you go along is that when you write later bits you might come up with ideas or change your mind on some things which makes previously written material wrong. If you've already posted things that are now inaccurate, this can be pretty frustrating. I know some people refuse to post at all until they've finished the entire story because of this.

Relatedly, something I've been meaning to ask is what size chunks people like to post or read? Lately I've been doing around 1.5k-2k in mine, SubRosa's said she posts 2k-3k...


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Acadian
post Aug 15 2011, 08:08 PM
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QUOTE(Kazaera @ Aug 15 2011, 11:44 AM) *

...Relatedly, something I've been meaning to ask is what size chunks people like to post or read? Lately I've been doing around 1.5k-2k in mine, SubRosa's said she posts 2k-3k...


As a writer and reader, I prefer episodes of 1-2K posted once or twice a week. My average is around 1600 words and I think you will find SubRosa's average episode length to be very similar. To me, the ideal episode would be 1200 words.

Sometimes it is necessary to go above 2K for a variety of reasons, but I try to avoid it as it invites skimming. I find that when I exceed 2K for an occasional episode it is usually to 'finish' something that began in the same episode - that if not finished would invite undesired or off track speculation. Building to an emotional crescendo can tempt us to run long as well, but I generally find that if I really want to deliver an emotional impact, I actually try very hard to keep the episode under 1K.

As far as the writing process, I 'storyboard' notes to describe concepts, waypoints or scenes out over hundreds of potential episodes - sort of a rough outline. As time draws closer, I transition upcoming aspects of the storyboard to draft prose. I try to work 6-10 episodes ahead in actual draft. I find that by keeping the more distant scenes in storyboard format until within a month or two of posting, it facilitates long range planning and avoids conflicts while allowing plenty of flexibility.



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Destri Melarg
post Aug 15 2011, 08:57 PM
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QUOTE(SubRosa @ Aug 15 2011, 09:06 AM) *

QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Aug 15 2011, 10:45 AM) *

Edit: Oh, one more thing. When you guys write stories, do you update your story by going along and adding new scenarios, or do you already have it all written down and just post regularly?


Some people write a segment, then post it, and then start writing the next segment, etc... Some people write an entire story from start to finish before posting. And finally some like me are in the middle, and write an entire chapter (say 10,000 words perhaps), and chop it up into individual posts of 2-3k words each.

Yeah, I fall in the first camp here. I tried to write ahead by several chapters but it just doesn't work for me. My favorite thing about writing for the forums is that sense of immediacy you get from the endeavor. Most of what I write occurs in a vacuum of (over)planning and revision, all of it pretty much on my own. Here I can let my hair down (so to speak) and allow the story to reveal itself to me as it reveals itself to the reader.

QUOTE(Kazaera @ Aug 15 2011, 11:44 AM) *

Relatedly, something I've been meaning to ask is what size chunks people like to post or read? Lately I've been doing around 1.5k-2k in mine, SubRosa's said she posts 2k-3k...

I'd say that anywhere in there would be fine. You want enough to give us a hearty meal upon reading, but not so much that we decide to skim the fat and feed it to the dog. Only you can determine your own perfect length. Someone who isn't as adept with word choice as Acadian would find 1200 a stifling word count.


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Kazaera
post Aug 15 2011, 09:12 PM
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Thanks for the feedback, all!

QUOTE(Destri Melarg @ Aug 15 2011, 08:57 PM) *

QUOTE(SubRosa @ Aug 15 2011, 09:06 AM) *

QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Aug 15 2011, 10:45 AM) *

Edit: Oh, one more thing. When you guys write stories, do you update your story by going along and adding new scenarios, or do you already have it all written down and just post regularly?


Some people write a segment, then post it, and then start writing the next segment, etc... Some people write an entire story from start to finish before posting. And finally some like me are in the middle, and write an entire chapter (say 10,000 words perhaps), and chop it up into individual posts of 2-3k words each.

Yeah, I fall in the first camp here. I tried to write ahead by several chapters but it just doesn't work for me. My favorite thing about writing for the forums is that sense of immediacy you get from the endeavor. Most of what I write occurs in a vacuum of (over)planning and revision, all of it pretty much on my own. Here I can let my hair down (so to speak) and allow the story to reveal itself to me as it reveals itself to the reader.


Ooh, that's a good pro for posting immediately that I hadn't thought of. It's been frustrating me that now all the stuff I'm posting and am getting beautiful feedback on is from what I wrote years ago, and the bits I'm writing now - where I'd really like to both show off the bits I'm proud of and check whether the things I'm unsure about work for people - I probably won't be posting for two months at this kind of update speed. And of course that's unavoidable if you post with a multi-chapter buffer.

This post has been edited by Kazaera: Aug 15 2011, 09:12 PM


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Thomas Kaira
post Oct 10 2011, 04:46 AM
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Okay, I have a conundrum here. I have a piece of drafting that doesn't really seem to fit in anywhere in my grand scheme... but at the same time I don't want to get rid of it.

So... help?


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SubRosa
post Oct 10 2011, 08:57 AM
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It is hard to give a very specific answer without more details. But just speaking in general, write it. Write anything that moves you to do so. Even if you never post it. The more practice you get, the better you become.


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Grits
post Oct 10 2011, 11:31 AM
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One of the most helpful tools I have is a file named “Jerric’s Story Didn’t Use.” It’s mostly scenes that I wrote and then cut from the story, either in the last edits or from the outline when I wrote too far ahead. (There is more written from Darnand’s POV in this file than in the posted story.)Keeping the material somewhere makes it easier for me to trim it, so I can go ahead and write out the ideas that sort of seize me without worrying too much first about whether they’ll fit.

As SageRosa said, practice makes you better. I don’t regret a single hour that I have spent writing, whether or not the material gets posted in any form.


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Athynae
post Oct 10 2011, 11:54 AM
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I agree with SubRosa and Grits and I'll add that I go as far as to save, somewhere, fleeting thoughts or single sentences. Technology obviously makes this much easier, back when the dinosaurs roamed the earth I had a notebook that had as many napkins and pieces of brown paper bag as it did regular paper. The benefit to me, sometimes a single sentence can shake you out of a black hole.


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treydog
post Oct 11 2011, 01:05 AM
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I have few "rules" when it comes to writing- but one of the few is:

Write EVERYTHING down!

If an idea, a sentence, a word- grabs you- there is a reason. It may never "fit" with the story you are currently working on- or it may. If you do not keep it, you will never know. Sometimes an idea or an image is so compelling that it becomes worth your while to figure out how to "get there from here."

At worst, it may become a seed for something new.


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Thomas Kaira
post Oct 11 2011, 01:11 AM
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Thanks for the advice, all. smile.gif

I've moved the passage to a newly created "Cut Content" file to keep on hand in case a better context comes up for it later on, or if I choose to do a between-chapters interlude, or whatever else comes to mind.


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haute ecole rider
post Oct 11 2011, 02:38 PM
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That's what I did with Blanco's interlude in OHDH. I wrote it while the story online was still in the first Oblivion Gate stage, because I couldn't get that damn white horse out of my mind. When I promised him that it would be put in at the right point, he settled down and waited as patiently as Old Paint.

I've been in this situation before - I'd be hard at work on one story, and the creative juices just divert themselves to a new idea or a different concept. All I can do is write it down, put it aside, and find my focus again on the WIP. It helps to refocus if you write the distractions down and get them out of your head (like Boxee and his plot bunnies).


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Kazaera
post Oct 12 2011, 09:25 AM
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*nods* Sometimes I get seized by things that are far in the future for Adryn and end up going "no, it's not your turn yet!" but later regretting that, when I have to write it when the enthusiasm's gone out of it. The installment I'm just starting to post now took me <em>ages</em> to write, because at one point the idea just grabbed me but then I was still writing an earlier section and wanted to proceed in linear continuous fashion! and by the time I actually reached it that was gone and I really struggled with the dialogue and everything. So now I have some documents marked "Adryn - snippets" in my SitC folder; I know that often I'll need to rewrite chunks of it by the time I actually get there because I'll have changed things around in the intervening time or maybe toss the whole thing altogether, but that's better than the alternative.

...also, there's an idea ghosting around my head that I might eventually write if it solidifies more which is actually a crack DnD/Morrowind crossover set in Adrynverse. Chances of that ever making it into SitC are just about *zero* but it's fun!



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Jacki Dice
post Oct 12 2011, 08:08 PM
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I do that too. For Wrothken's stuff I have a doc for the current chapter and then another one where I store all past chapters and at the bottom are little reminders or full scenes I have planned for the future. Only bad part is I get sucked into some of those and neglect the current one tongue.gif


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McBadgere
post Oct 22 2011, 06:55 PM
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Does anyone sit there and go right I have a start, middle and finish of this section, and then as you're writing, everything gets so far apart that you can barely imagine finishing the thing?...Or is everyone so disciplined that it all comes out just the way you thought?... biggrin.gif ...

This post has been edited by McBadgere: Oct 22 2011, 06:56 PM
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treydog
post Oct 22 2011, 07:44 PM
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QUOTE(McBadgere @ Oct 22 2011, 01:55 PM) *

Does anyone sit there and go right I have a start, middle and finish of this section, and then as you're writing, everything gets so far apart that you can barely imagine finishing the thing?...Or is everyone so disciplined that it all comes out just the way you thought?... biggrin.gif ...

Restraining myself from laughing hysterically- NOT at you- or at anyone else who actually has a.... plan or... discipline. Just trying to apply those terms to my own method.

What I have discovered is that my plans end up having almost nothing to do with the reality. And the stories are better for it.... The word I use is "organic." And while that COULD imply that my writing might be useful as compost, in this case... it means that the stories have a tendency to GROW in unexpected ways.

So- short answer- the current story started with the beginning and the ending. For the rest it was kind of like- well, let's see what happens. And then... well then, Athynae happened.

For writing, there are as many ways of "doing it right" as there are writers. To add to my rule above (write everything down)- there is this one- HAVE FUN! And you know, those may be the only rules for writing I can think of.


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Thomas Kaira
post Oct 22 2011, 08:02 PM
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I tried planning large portions in advance... that got me nowhere fast.

I work much more in the short-term now. All I define in the broad spectrum is where I want things to start, who the Big Bad is, and how things will end. Then I just let the tale write itself from prelude to conclusion. My individual segments tend to follow a similar style as well, except replacing the Big Bad with whatever I want to happen at that time. I then keep track of what has happened to determine when and where I can make something else happen for it to carry weight with the readers. Pacing is everything. Don't bore your readers with endless heart-to-hearts and one-on-ones, but at the same time don't tire them out with chapter after chapter of nonstop action.

Keep all channels open for ideas, and let your characters direct your fingers on the keyboard. The rest will come through time, patience, and a lot of editing.

I usually end up rewriting large portions of my conversations up to three times before I finally feel it is "right." As in right, I mean everything comes naturally, there are no breaks in character, and it doesn't feel like anything is being forced along.

This post has been edited by Thomas Kaira: Oct 22 2011, 08:05 PM


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bbqplatypus
post Oct 23 2011, 05:47 AM
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My problem has always been time. Time and procrastination. I've always been meaning to go back to my old story The Interim and re-write it. It's...got problems, to put it mildly. There are parts of it that I can't even bear to read. I could do it a thousand times better now.

But now I don't have the time - largely because I kept putting it off when I DID have the time. And now it might never end up getting done. So yeah...my advice: just suck it up and do it. Not very profound, but more difficult than it sounds if you're like me.

This post has been edited by bbqplatypus: Oct 23 2011, 05:48 AM
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ghastley
post Oct 24 2011, 07:01 PM
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What NOT to do is what I just did.

Since Skyrim is approaching, and I'd only played and modded Oblivion, I thought I'd try something earlier. Morrowind is still theoretically for sale, but I can't find a copy in the shops. So I download Daggerfall and install it. I want to play my fave Oblivion character, Blossom, but you can't play an Orc in Daggerfall. So I start modding the game so I can.

IPB Image

Then I have to make some more clothes and armor for her, and look at how the quest system works, and ...

I just stopped myself from re-installing MS Visual Studio so I could rewrite a save game editor that wasn't working properly.

I just caught back up on the stories I've been reading, now to catch up on what I was writing!


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McBadgere
post Oct 25 2011, 06:16 AM
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*Attempts to wrench eyes away from Orc in thigh high boots and thong... ohmy.gif ...*...

Aye, the only reason I plan is 'cause of something I read in the Terry Brooks book "Sometimes The Magic Happens". He says in it that he gets totally lost if he just leaves the plot wandering laugh.gif ...So he has the beginning, middle and end. He also has every character with names that will turn up, and all the rest of it. I'm not going to be that strict but I appreciate what you said about different styles for different writers and all that.

Oh, and the time thing...I have two hours to write in during the day...And that's if I get up at an ungodly hour...Which I haven't for the last two days...I hate that...*Wails* I wanna be young again!!!.... biggrin.gif ...Too busy in work and stuff...Too tired!!...*Goes off to make coffee...*...

Urgh... wacko.gif ...
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