I don't think there should be UN vetos, or EU vetos or any vetos, beacause it's unjust.

This is my point.

The country that has a government that has been telling its people for the last 5 years that the UN is completely useless and should be disbanded, has been protecting the very thing that made it useless. It was the veto that stopped troops from acting in Iraq, and when that happened the US said the UN was useless, but when something turns up that involves pollution regulation, it's the US that hides behind the veto, and nobody else. The US government uses the UN to stop many other countries from doing something productive, but when we can't do something productive, suddenly the entire country comes rushing behind this "It should be disbanded" stance.

There, sorry I had to corner you guys like that.

This post has been edited by DoomedOne: Aug 3 2005, 06:01 AM

Corner? I was on vacation.

You speak for a few US citizens. I believe the UN is pointless, it had its use in comunism now its a out-dated thing.

Frankly I think the US should just leave the UN.

Channler, I say this with the utmost respect.

You're on the bandwagon. How much do you know about the UN? Do you know about the hundreds of peace agreement the UN have managed to create over the years? Do you know about hundreds of different relief funds the UN organized in order to help other countries that faced disaster? What most Americans know about the UN was that France vetoed the US' resolution to wage war on Iraq. The UN did not support a selfish, greedy resolution, and in my opinion that's one of the smartest things the Security Council has done. Even without the veto the Security Council turned down the US' resolution, meanwhile the US, being the "grand democracy" that it is constantly hides behind the tyrannical veto in order to make sure resolutions do not pass that don't go in occordance with its own questionable agenda. That's the reason our current regime thinks the UN should no longer exist. No matter how much good it has done and continues to do, because it does not follow the US agenda it should suddenly be disbanded. What happened back in the Reagan era when the Soviet Union fell? Suddenly we were using the UN to our advantage. Suddenly we needed it, and though we acted ungrateful we used it to make ourselves the most powerful country in the world. Now what? A few countries decide to take advantage of the system the same way we did and suddenly it should be destroyed.

Oh, and here's something funny. This country, as of 2004, no longer consists of checks and balances. That entire system has been overturned. This country is split by, what is it? 4 million votes. That's like a drop of water in a bucket. Democrats and Republicans are almost exactly 50-50. However, Republicans control the senate, the house, the presidency, the supreme court... there no longer is equal representation. How does this tie into the UN you ask? Well, obviously that system is faulty, and instead of fixing the problems (any attempt to amend the security council has been harshly denied by the US) everyone wants to get rid of it. Well, this country's system is faulty, so why don't we just get rid of it?

Final comment: The UN is not useless, it is outdated. It needs to be fixed up, amended to suit the current world order. However, ANY attempt made to amend to UN has failed because of the US. It is a great system, it has helped resolve many conflicts and aid many countries in time of crisis, but the US is willing to ignore that because they refuse to fix a faulty system.

Typical... You don't want to actually confront someone’s opinion so you resort to an argument that could be accurately summed up with the childish slogan "well your just brain washed, so <=P!" I thought this was supposed to be a discussion and trading of opinions. I don't think social slandering falls under that description.

I hate using this emoticon, but . So, the US is perfect, and the rest of the world is terrible, and we'll never need their help? We can exist detached from the rest of civilization?

This post has been edited by Stargazey: Aug 7 2005, 11:08 PM

The only help will ever get from the UN is constant reminder of how were supposed to run our goverment. "We should do this and that and if we don't do it then we'll start vetoing things."

If we split from the UN we still would be part of G8 so we could still keep going without them.

Can someone please tell me what was the latest thing the UN did to help us out as a country? I can't remember... if there was anything in the first place.

This post has been edited by jonajosa: Aug 7 2005, 11:15 PM

They clean up our mess


Newt Gingrich likes them

When did I say the US is perfect?... uh.. never? But it seems that we are doing alot of things that are agianst what PART of the UN thinks is right.

BTW Lemme say that I thought the UN should of been disabandoned when they thought about letting (If they did I have no idea) Fedal Castro (SP) on the security council.

I never understood why everyone hates Castro. So, he's a communist, big deal. So are thousands of people in the US.

I agree. So Communism is different than what you believe in, big whoop. I've talked to people from Cuba and they said artists and doctors get big help from the government. Though the Cuban missle crisis hurt Communism's reputation.

Yah, that’s why hundreds of people risk their lives every year crossing the Gulf of Mexico just to get out of Cuba. That why free speech and religious freedom is so harshly suppressed in Cuba. But hey, big deal right...

This post has been edited by Fade2gray: Aug 8 2005, 06:32 AM

Guys, theres way too much sarcasm flying around for this to be a respectful debate. Bring it down a notch.

We all know sarcasm leads to the Dark Side. As well as flame wars.

Do you ever wonder how many people leave the US because they don't like this government?

I don't think thats a bad thing. I would rather have them complain somewhere else than here.

The world would be a better place if people didn´t complain all the time......all governments have their pro´s and con´s.....

I A gree with doomed one in that the UN is old and needs serious remodeling.

That does seem to be a lot of what this boils down to doesn't it. People seem to have this fixation with the con's. If you only ever look at the problems with something they begin to seem greater than they really are, until eventually can't see anything else and come believe that that is all there is. That kind of thinking really colors a lot of people's views on everything from international politics to personal relationships. I see it all too often and it ain't pretty.

I dare you all to go to Keyna or Niger if all you want to do is complain about your government. THEY have a right to complain, and if I had my way in the UN, the nations leader would be disposed and a new democratic goverment would be voted in from the people.

First we get rid of their leaders, then we help them.