Foster,every narcotic is unhealthy.Legal,or not legal.

And you pretty much got the rough point:It's as bad as alcohol or cigaretes,so why is it not legal everywhere?As i said it's fun if used in normal dosages,you can't become an adict if used in normal dosages,so why the heck not?I also stated that it must be alowed for ADULTS ONLY,and as an adult,you should know what's good for you.I also INSIST of not using other strong drugs.That would screw up society a lot.But the way i see marijuana is doing here in Nederlands:I say it's pretty normal for it to be legal everywhere.

Oh, it's not just narcotics. Every DRUG can have bad effects. Anyway, just because it works in one country doesn't mean it's going to work in another. Take for example that other great institution of the Netherlands - Prostitution. I'm pretty sure that legalised prostitution wouldn't work everywhere, based on the opinions and beliefs of the society.

Anyway, I've made my viewpoint on the whole subject clear, I was just trying to work out your arguements, because pretty much all the pro-legalisation messages have done so far is debate the opinions of the non-legalisation camp by relating other issues into the equation. Kind of like what I just did with prositution. Ah, I'm such a hipocrite sometimes.

This post has been edited by Foster: Apr 27 2006, 11:28 PM

Prostitution is legal in Norway as well, but get this: Buying sexual services is not legal.

Anyway I think this is an ok solution. It keeps the prostitutes out of prison where they would probably become criminals, and their customers - which are normally quite wealthy and 'respectable' citizens - just get a fine if they're caught. Saves the government money and prison cells, and even makes them some money with the fines...

Sorry for the OT sidetrack, but I just felt like saying this...

But many of the prostitutes (at least in the US) are little more than slaves, being forced to work to gain someone else's money.

I don't think that's an 'okay solution' for those people.

This post has been edited by Dantrag: Apr 27 2006, 11:38 PM

I will tell how it is in Nederland:Those prostitutes earn a lot more money than an average citizen.So much of being ''slaves''......
EDIT:Double,to be more specific

Actualy it looks quite funny:They are actualy siting in VENDORS.
Yeah,you read this right ,in vendors.Nobody forced them to do so,they chose this because of the fat money.

But this is offtopic.If you want to comment my post,please send me a PM

This post has been edited by HyPN0: Apr 27 2006, 11:41 PM

I don't myself imbibe in mariquana, alcohol, tobacco or any addictive substance except caffeine, which I did give up but am back on, but I don't mind letting the people who are going to smoke it anyway do so legally. Many of the mariquanna smokers are doing it just for the thrill of the crime they are getting away with - so if you legalize it those people will probably quit. Hopefully they won't pick something more dangerous. And legalizing it will lower the price and take it out of the hands of the mobsters among us.
I think there might be a certain segment of society who would be ultra-nervous in today's hectic world if they couldn't sort of self-medicate themselves into calm with marijuanna. (finally spelled it right ehehe) As for it making for non-productive citizens, I think that it might actually give us more artists and musicians and poets .... which can't be a bad thing considering the harsh of modern day reality.

This post has been edited by Ibis: Apr 28 2006, 12:28 AM

Well true, but that has nothing to do with it being legal or not. In fact since it's illegal in the US the prostitutes are probably having a harder life than if it was legal and it was a 'real' job (they have to pay taxes in Norway, but I don't think they do... ). So I still think legalizing prostitution is an 'ok solution'. There has always been and always will be prostitutes anyway...

But I'm sorry once again about being off-topic. Maybe we could start a new thread regarding prostitution...

I think the dangers of weed are heavily exaggerated, and that our society would be no worse off than it is because cigerettes, alcohol, or TV is legal. It's just not a big deal, at most people get stoned too often and act washed all the time so they become useless human beings, but you can blame that on our directionless society, where it's cool to not want to do anything with yourself, and as long as you don't want a future you see nothing wrong with getting high every moment you get. Weed is no more addictive than good grapes.

Well that shows that there are differences in societies. Where are you from, btw? In Norway it's 'cool' to get as much education as possible and get the best job possible. Turns everyone into slaves of ambition, and people are all stressed out practically from they're born and until they die (from stress )



I got a strong urge for grapes after reading this line, although I hardly ever eat grapes!

I was talking in the US.

De si, zemljache and it's actually 'Classic NISH CITY "slack" attitude'
Nah, God doesen't concern himself with such petty misbehaving... but anyway, I've taken care of that lil' stash I had, so there's no need for worry now (and no, I'm not telling you what did I do with it ).
Anyway, I've tried cannabis mixed with tobacco a few times and all I can say is YUCK tobacco is Teh Devil, I tell ya. I'll never understand people who smoke it - but then, no one will understand how I can drink insane quantities of black coffee without sugar.

p.s.: I guess that, at some points, everything causes a living organism to be stressed and damaged - even food and water. Concieder 20 years of drinking tap water dangerous... and then add unproper nutrition, not enough physical activities, coffe + ciggs, alcohol... and voila ! You don't need drugs to ruin your yourself (I'm such a happy camper, aren't I ? )

This post has been edited by milanius: Apr 29 2006, 11:25 AM

I would! I do it myself! But yore right almost anything can be dangerous if you overdo it!

Don't worry i'm sure it's gone!
About not mixing it with tabbacoo:Whatever you were smoking was crap.Stop by in Nederland sometimes and try this weed without tabbacco.I'm sure you'll be done in about 3 smokes.the first times i tryed marijuana in Nederlands was without tabbacco,and i had quite a cough.

The coffee you're having in western Europe is NOTHING compared to coffee in Serbia & Montenegro!
While you're having coffee from a coffee mashine we're making coffee in.....argh,i don't know the word.Anyway it's made in a metal ''pot'' and it's a LOT stronger for your stomach.I belive they're making the same type of coffee it Turkey.Give it a try sometimes

heh, nice way of putting it but I fear I have to respectfully disagree with your opinion Sleepy.

Responsibility or irresponsibility, if that would be a cause for not allowing something to be legitemate then I guess it's time to ban all weapons, from every country, as well as all alcohol, and all medicine, and all needles, and probably all the knives, forks and spoons and more as well since you can count on some irresponsible people using that to cause damage

Yes...why not.....erhmm....I did try in Turkey some years ago and I liked it so....


Yes Alex...you´re right I agree on that, you have to assume people have some kind of responsibility by themselves huh....

I mean I don´t consider myself as irresponsible just because I´ve tried some "stuff" when I was younger

I disagree. Responsibility and irresponsibility is a factor - if it wasn't we wouldn't have legal ages for gambling, sexual activity, purchase of alcohol and cigerettes, collection of medication and marriage.

What the judgement is made on is responsibility and irresponsibility being a factor in a risk/benefit analysis - the benefits of having forks outweigh the risks of someone trying to poke someone with them. The benefits of cannabis (if there are any - the only one I can see is that some people want to use it to relax) are outweighed by the risks.

Hmmm,as i said i belive they're serving that kind of coffee in Turkey.It's really strong,and it has some black stuff at the bottom of the cup.That kind of coffee is good for me too

Actualy in my country such limitations don't exist (at least they didn't exist while i was still there,i don't know how is there now).But you said it yourself:Such things are allowed only when a person gets to a certain age.So why not allow marijuana at age 18?I think we all agree that it isn't any worse that alcohol.


Is that so?
And who determines how big risk\benefit does a certain thing have?Society?Government?I will tell you what society\governmet thinks about certain substances:

Alcohol - Risks greatly overweight the benefits.I will only mention some risks such as liver cancer,lack of self-control,some people are quite agressive when they're drunk.While the only benefits i can think of are used in medicine (to clean the wounds or such).100% legal.

Cigarettes - Now let's see:They are bad for your health,you become adictive,you actualy PAY to poison yourself,and you're endangering others.I mean WTF?That defyes every posible logic!But people WANT to smoke cigarettes,they are aware it's bad for health and adictive,but they still want to do it.Nobody's forcing them to do it,they chose it themself,even though they know the risks. 100% legal,no benefits.I quit smoking,but even today when i'm drinking coffe,i say:Damn i could use a cig right now.But it's passing over time.

McDonald's - I feel i'lll get flamed for this.The fact is that McDonald's is unhealthy food.McDonald's food can make you fat,has no healthy things for your body,and what most people don't know,it must be eaten right away.Try buying a burger,and keep it for about a week(you can puit it ib your fridge,it won't make a differnce).I sugest you don't eat it though.It may contain diseases, at least people who worked at McDonald'd told me.The left-overs are thrown in containers and locked,so that poor people won't eat it and get a disease. 100% legal,no real benefits (It's better for you to eat that brokoly)

Coca-Cola - Ahhhh!Let's try a test shall we?Get a glass of coce,and put a chicken leg in it.Let 24 hours pass.See the results.The same thing happens in your stomach.That's why you have that thing on your bottle,writen in small letters:You can drink [a certain amount,i can't remember now] a day.Otherwise you can get a diareya(sp?). 100% legal,no benefits to society (better drink some nice clear water)

NOTE:As i said over-use of such things can have bad effects.Drinking a glass of wine a day,can improve your heartwork (confirmed by doctors).Casualy eating at Mac,won't make you fat.Casualy smoking marijuana won't make you an adict,and won't harm you in any way.

Marijuana won't benefit society in any case,that's for sure.
But if an adult WANT'S to smoke marijuana,and he\she knows what are the risks\benefits (No benefits),why forbid him\her to buy it.Wait,did't i already said this in one of my previus posts.Nevermind.

It's not all about ''benefiting'' society.If it was so,we would be living in the world like......You kow that movie with Silvester Stalone?Where everything is forbiden,even to eat bacon (holesterol).That's how would our world look like.Boring and Cold.

Casual(moderate) use of marijuana = Fun,and not dangerous

Like I've said, just because something bad has got through the system isn't a reason why we should let anything else through.



Really? The same thing happens in my stomach? My stomach? The one with a natural pH that is strongly acidic? The stomach that has Hydrochloric acid in it? The one that is lined with various mechanisms and barriers to stop corrosion because otherwise we'd all be dead from the acid in there? The stomach that has acids stronger than those in Cola, which has a pH of about 2.5? REALLY? Wow. I must have missed something in physiology, or all those classes I've taken where I learnt that cola doesn't corrode your stomach. So on that point, you've been taught incorrectly. Pepsi was actually made to initially sort out stomach pains.

And do that experiment yourself. The concentrations of the acid in Cola are so low that all you'll have is one soggy chicken leg after 24 hours. Oh, eventually it'll corrode. But 24 hours? That's an urban legend, nothing more.


The rest of it I'm just going to refer to our previous arguements on it, seeing as you're repeating exactly the same points, and I'm just going to repeat the same points I did.

I probably forgot to mention that i'm not an expert in such things.But what i wanted to say is that if used too much,it can have negative effects (you didn't quote that part of my sentence )And that's personal experience


Fair enough.
I did notice that i'm repeating myself constantly

This post has been edited by HyPN0: Apr 29 2006, 05:58 PM

Foster, there is no risk/benefit factor taken into consideration by our government. It may exist to you, but to most companies and politicians out there, the risk is less money, the benefit is more money.

Marijuanas benefits outweigh the risks, the way I see it. In fact, the way I see it, they HEAVILY outweigh the risks. Cocacola risks DO NOT outweight the benefit, unless you are an invester in Coca Cola, or a lobbyist for Coca Cola, or a politician lobbied by coca cola, in which case there's a lot of money in it for you to keep coca cola popular.

Note: In california public schools are not allowed to have coke in their vending machines or food services during school hours, as well as most other drinks and snacks with too many calories.

Anyway, the same story goes for pharmceutical drugs, such as antidepressants. In my opinion, these new antidepressants' risks outweight the benefit. Sure, you can SAY "Don't use if you have a history or mania, or if your pregnant, or if you're young, or if you've ever been to las vegas..." but obviously if a man kidnapped, murdered, raped and planned to eat a young girl because his antidepressant medication was triggering his mania and giving him bizarre fantasies (true story) then something went wrong. But, again, there's a gigantic lobby to keep them legal which adds a lot of pressure to politcians not to touch them, it makes people ignore the strange test results they got from them.

I mean, the studies weren't thorough enough when it came to what happens when you stop taking drugs like zoloft and prozac. The answer hit the US back up the boat with teen suicides as caused by the antidepressants. Now tell me the benefits outweigh the risks. Of course, it depends whose using them, if the perfect candidate (Joe, a 30 year old perfectly sane man whose life is perfectly balanced and is well passed his rocky teenage years... and has never been to Vegas) takes them he's fine. But we live in a society of misdiagnosis, and plenty of people will still be given drugs they shouldn't be.

If marijuana was legal, the same warning would be there as cigerttes, and to the same degree since cigerette warnings in the Unites States don't really capture the picture of what cigerettes do to the body. People would know the proper dosage, people would be more likely to follow the regulations put in place for marijuana, just as using them in the proper clubs, and here's the big one... IT'D NO LONGER BE A GATEWAY DRUG!

Here is why weed is a gateway drug, I'll spell it out for you. You're in smoking sessions with people every week, and for many kids every day. You're buying it from people who are consciously doing something illegal, and know how to not get caught, and like making money. Many dealers around here carry other things besides weed. Many people around here do other things besides weed, when I smoke weed with these people, I'm introduced to other illegal substances.

Alcohol doesn't have the same problem. You can get alcohol straight from a store, and even if you couldn't people would buy it from the store to get it, you don't have to go through some sketchy dealer. Marijuana would be the exact same story, and therefore by legalizing marijuana, you'd actually make kids LESS LIKELY to try cocaine, heroine, meth, etcetera. You'd be striking a blow against the drug cartels by taking out one of their products. God knows they took a heavy freaking blow when prohibition ended.