Oh god... I'm all sweaty...

Sweden owned in the second half, nothing else to say - England's scoring was good, but he was totally alone - a shame but Sweden pressed hard and scored... Great!







Hehe - Sweden deserved to win I think, then England could've met Germany lol

Mmmm it would have been a lot easier........

What is it with our seeming inability to beat Sweden? They're a completely unexciting football team with two class players and a bunch of grafters that somehow just muddle through. Still, they should frustrate Germany. Hopefully they'll knock them out like a Gustavus Adolphus Lutzen stylee (yes, I know he was killed at Lutzen, but he owned that battle) and then get scuppered by the superlative Argentinians. Now, I hate Argentinian as much as the next Englishman that remembers the hand of God (or the foot of Simeone), but they're something else this tournament. Actually, I doubt it. Sweden are just a boring, boring, mediocre side. They'll probably get absolutely stuffed.

Still, England are scuppered now. My main question is this - what the hell was the point of taking Theo Walcott if you're not going to play him? You lose a striker, you've got a striker injured, your other striker is on a yellow card, the match is unimportant - why not put on a 17 year old who has only played 20-odd games for a 2nd division side and only holds a provisional driving license?

I must say I feel somewhat offended by the above remarks Foster......What´s the matter with you? Bad looser?

No minky...he is a british, who have witnessed that England have never managed to win over Sweden the last 38years or so....so it is only natural that he say such a thing.

Nut Imust say that such a remark is insulting, after all, if they are som mediochre, and only ahve two star players, I do wonder how the **** they have managed to defeat England the last thirty or so years...and the British team who is supposed to be all star players....life's little ironies perhaps.

Oi! I'm British, a huge football fan, and I didnt say that! Bah...

Agree with him about Walcott though Should have brought Defoe. Sweden are just our bogey team, half their players play (or played) in England, so they know us inside out, and their shape and formation match ours, so they're hard to break down. That and they're exceedingly tenacious.

Uhm... who did we lose against? We're the ones that are top of the group. I'm saying Sweden are a boring and mediocre side because they are. They are a team of grafters, with no flair, whose success isn't so much due to any flamboyant displays of skill but rather dogged determination. Sweden are boring because they aren't an interesting side to watch, and they are mediocre because they aren't great, and they aren't crap - they're just... there. They don't go out to dazzle the world, they go out there to make things awkward for the opposition and scrape a draw. They are, for all intents and purposes, a stalemate side. The most boring in the tournament.

Other than Larsson and Ljungberg, they don't have any star talent. They have a bunch of players that are okay. But I don't find people going on about how great the mighty Teddy Lucic is in defence, or the super-cat reflexes of Hedman. If he were that good, he wouldn't have spent the majority of his career at Coventry City.

Now, the only reason they get anywhere is by getting draws - they've done it for the last couple of tournaments. So when they come up against Germany, who haven't got a good side either but play with a robotic and efficent style (plus home support), what you're going to get is two teams grinding away at each other, until home advantage comes into play. Then the winner of that will get anihilated by Argentina.

Not being rude - it's true.

lol Foster... Can't believe you can say that Sweden is boring when we've all seen the games by England so far.

First of all - Who brough the game alive in the second half? That was Sweden, Sweden out classed England in the second half, having dozen of good chances and England was only lucky that Sweden didn't take the lead. If Sweden has two stars and the rest is okey, then they were WAY better than the stars in the english team yesterday. When England managed to score on like their first big chance in the second half, Sweden pushed on even harder and got a well deserved goal because they wanted it...

I really can't understand that you say that England has so much flair and go out to dazzle the world while Sweden doesn't. You can look at the styles they play and see that it's very much the like, first of all - because the english coach - Sven brought in a swedish style of playing when he took over.

What your saying is typical english, at least when I compare it from what I've heard from other english men I know... And I clearly understand that Minque kinda get's offended. But OK, you can have your opinions - no problem with that.

I doubt that England will make it fair this tournament as well - Because in the end, around the quarter finals or what ever - they usually come up against teams like Brazil, Argentina, Spain etc etc. And there's the little problem with England, is that nearly the WHOLE team plays in the Premier League which comes out as a problem since almost no one of them is used to playing against teams who plays a totally different style like other european football clubs. And the lack of experiance playing against teams who play a totally different style than the one in Premier League is the one that usually holds them from winning - but then again, that's only my opinion.

They're not boring, they're just rubbish. They are trying to do things and failing, which is different from playing like Arsenal under George Graham.



Point the part where I said that out to me. I seem to remember saying Argentina had flair, but I haven't said a damn thing about England playing even remotely well. England in this tournament have been uncommitted, incoherent and not working as a team. They've been reliant on tactics that don't suit the style of play, have two forces in midfield that don't gel, and now have only 1 fit striker that we seem willing to play.

England are not playing like tournament winners.

Well remember that Arsenal is full of frenchmen


Well looks like we pretty much agree - even thought I wouldn't say Sweden is rubbish, the disapointed me in their first matches but played well against England...

Rose like a pheonix in the second half

I really dont understand why you react like this...if Sweden is rubbish, than England is just soo much more rubbish....they have not managed to defeat Sweden for over thiry years, and that just say that England is not better than Sweden....most of those matches, have resulted in VICTORY for Sweden.

So, I say that when you argue so much that you do now, you're a very sore looser, but you are allowed your oppinions and I have mine...just donbt get this post as a negative...I do not wish to flame you or anything, just think that you act like a sore looser, when you critisice a football team that played really well, and have managed to defeat or get draws againt you for the last thirty years.

Either you really haven't been paying attention even a little bit, or you're just trolling. I would have agreed 4 years ago, 8 years ago, 12 years ago and at all previous tournaments, but this time? C'mon.

Right, first things first.



Since managing in Sweden, he's managed in Portugal and then for clubs in Italy. If anything, it's less a Swedish style of playing he introduced and more an Italian style. Defend, keep clean sheets and try to grab a goal on the counter attack. When a goal up, retreat and try to cling on to what we have. Great in theory, but we can't pull it off like the Italians. We tend to keep charging forwards (albeit with a fondness for aimless long balls that drive every football fan in this country crazy), we just don't have the patience or tactical nous like some countries. We just keep going forwards, even when we need to keep possession (the other thing we can't do and which drives everyone crazy).



Nah, thats not true any more. Almost every single player in the England team played in the Champions League this season, so we don't have that excuse any more. Sadly.

Sweden and England are actually very similar teams. Physically strong, never know when they're beaten, 2 lines of four which is very difficult to play through. What I would say is that England do have better individuals, but that means nothing as Sweden did play better as a team. And I wouldn't say they were boring either, they just approach the game in the same way. Both sides play too many long balls for this level, give away possession too cheaply. We'd have played better football if Owen hadn't got injured, as we'd have had to play to feet. Crouch makes it too easy to hit it high, as with his height he'll win it in the air (well, theoretically). Same with Sweden last night. Ibramavich had he been fit is world class, and likes it to feet. With him missing Sweden tried to bypass the midfield, and have Larrson running on to an Allback flick. And it worked.

So, stalemate, both sides through, well done to both and good luck in the next game.

Germany doesn't have as good a side as it did at any of the previous tournaments, with the exception of the 2000 side. Really they weren't good in 2002 either. Now they've lost their entire old guard, and have a few quality players, but their ability is nothing compared to that of Italy, Spain, Argentina, Brazil or the Netherlands. They've looked shaky at times despite their goals, and the reason I think they are doing well is home support carrying them up.

Sweden. The T&T match, the Paraguay match, the 1st half of the England match they were a basic, mediocre side. I have NOT said that Sweden is rubbish - ever. That's just a bunch of irate peeps misquoting me because I'm saying their side is mediocre - average. It's nothing special. They only have two players that shine, and so they grind out their results by getting draws. They play boring football. They don't have the fine touches or the crafty skills; they have grafters.

Sweden are NOT rubbish. I haven't said that. Nor have I said that they wern't better than England at times during the game - for 25 minutes in the second half it was one way traffic to the boys in capon yellow. What I have said, and what I will continue to say, is that Sweden are not a world class side, they only have two star quality players, and that they work hard together as a tough team to grind out results. I don't think anyone is mental enough to say that Sweden look better than Argentina, which is probably why you've all decided to make out like I'm talking about England.

And the George Graham Arsenal side I was referring to was before the French influx - it was a time when they won the old first division by sheer tenacity. They had a solid (not great, but solid) defence with an average midfield and a basic, goal-poaching attack. They had maybe two star players in that team, and no more. Seriously - John Lukic? Steve Bould? Alan Smith? They aren't legends of the game, and they beat a Liverpool side containing such players as Ian Rush and John Barnes. Liverpool were an infinitely better side (and I'm not likening them to the English side at present), and still lost out to a hard working but ultimately mediocre side.

I think that part there, basically shows that you said Sweden was rubbish.

An for the record I'm Norwegian...NOT Swedish, but I kinda detest people who complains about teams, saying like they're rubbish...especially when their team just recently didnt beat them.

So, next time, try to say it in a nicer way, so that those from the same nationality, ort who is cheering for that team dont feel offended....there are after all many different oppinions here in the world...the secret is to safely package them in, so they do not insult anyone

And in case you have startedto wonder, I DO NOT dislike the English team, nor do I hold any grudge towards you or any other British...

Tellie out.

Hehe... This thread is finally starting to get interesting...

A few words from a hobby philosopher who don't know the first thing about football:

I can understand Foster's frustration. UK have always been a major football power, and a benchmark to all other nations except for South American countries. They have the Premier League, the hooligans, the football pubs, England as a football team etc. etc., and the dream of every football interested teen in Norway (for example) has always been to play on a team from the UK - the Almighty Football Power.

But we all know that times and people are constantly changing, whether we like it or not. A nation's power and influence is directly related to it's citizens, whether it be in war or sports (which is very much related, for that matter), and as citizens get older and replaced, this power and influence follows in the footstep, although with a little bit of lag.

Now that other countries are finally catching up with the all-time favorites just because of some luck with players (humans!), it is hard for traditionally raised people to acknowledge this fact, and they try desperately to find solutions and excuses for why this is happening.

Bottom line: A team is nothing more than the players playing on that team, and those players are as random as lotto numbers. A team of humans/players will of course change as time progresses and the humans get replaced.

Our modern world with live TV and instant communication do of course affect this balance, so a team from Asia (for example) might just as well be as good as a team from the homeworld of fotball just a few decades ago, namely because of this, as is the fact for all other sports/businesses/careers etc etc...

Final note: Like mentioned at the start I have no real knowledge of football. The above statements are simply posted based on common sense. Anyone feel free to set me wrong and I will (perhaps) yield.

No, that's the part where I say that England are not boring, just rubbish. Probably my own fault for not being completely clear - those two sentences can look like I'm accusing Sweden of both faults, so I shall clarify.

England can be rubbish at times.

Sweden are a boring and mediocre team.

It's my opinion. It's not to offend, it's just the way I see it. I'm not someone who just scour the forums looking for possible threads to report to mods, or just something to complain about. I'm just saying that Sweden are a boring team, and if they don't get knocked out by Germany, they'll get knocked out more than likely by Argentina. England I'm guessing out at the quarters/semis.


This post has been edited by Foster: Jun 21 2006, 08:11 PM

Foster, you qouted me - When I stated that you said Sweden was boring and then you wrote "They're not boring, only rubbish" but anyway, I understand that your not trying to offend anyone, but football is something I and many others hold dear, as a scandinavian I will stand up and defend Sweden.

Both Sweden and England had a bad opening and as burntsierra said, both teams play pretty much the same style.

But of course, you can think that the Swedes are a boring and mediocre team, but I disagree on that when it comes to the SWE vs ENG match, but the first two matches was rather disappointing and I thought that Sweden would do better...

But - I think this is the kinda of discussion we should have in this thread, discussing each teams performance etc.

Watching Netherlands vs Argentina now, really looking forward to see who will make the first goal. Came back 5 min ago, so only catched from 60 min.

Any thoughts of who will win or will it be a draw?

Well Burntsierra is also british, but he would never blurt it out like that! And aye I´m only half-swedish but I still like Sweden´s football-team!



Mmmm you may have a point there!


Ok you didn´t loose but you didn´t win either! Then again I can somewhat understand you said they are boring....they did not show off all the time like some of the stars from England did....no they played like a team, hard work, blood and sweat, and so on. Oh aye it´s not that fancy but it did some good didn´t it?


No..no they´re not...you are so right!



Yes Tellie...I think dear Foster takes it pretty hard that England haven´t defeated Sweden in 38 years! OMG you guys weren´t even born when it happened last! BUT I WAS!!! I even watched the game!



Gah....don´t worry Foster....they will get knocked out by Germany......!!

Woho, I am away for, what ? Eight days ? and this turns into a friggin' flame war ? People, we are seeing some seriously unattractive and physical football on ALL sides, not just Germany or Sweden or England (who, btw, aren't playing to the top of their abilities :\) - but that is just the way it is. Tonight, Japan drew the first blood against Brasil and that hopefuly managed to be their wake up call - even for the FAT RONALDO, who has scored 2 times (unbelivable, for someone who looks more & more like a WHALE )... so, in the end, we finally have some of that ol' Brazilian glitter, and a goddamn well deserved butt-kicking result of 4:1. It was about bloody time someone puts underdogs in their place.

Post commentary on Serbia's performance in WC2006:
"EVERYONE SHOULD BE KILLED" [Grind Core band A.C., I will not tell you what those letters stand for, it's just too vulgar - PM me if you really must know]

For Our national Coatch, Petko, who has said "I should've been brave and stick to my vision of firm, defensive and sturdy football" I have this to say: If you're not GOD and SUPREME RULER inside your team, if there's someone ABOVE you who pulls your strings and forces you to do things you don't want to do, then you should've resigned months ago and get the f*** out. End of story.

For Our Wannabe Captain & Star, Deki, who said "People should be lucky and praise us because we were even able to quallify into last 32" I have this to say: If I was, by any insane chance, Serbian National Coach, I would promptly kick your a** out of the team 5 minutes after you said that - furtermore, You would NEVER get to play for Serbian team, let alone be the skipper, at least while I'm the selector... A winner doesen't say "meh, this is good enough". A winner always, ALWAYS, strives to do more, achieve more and inspire his comrades... and you failed to do that with each other, and be the team. End of cat juggling story.



p.s.: THANKS STARGE ! Now we play for the same team... but we still need someone strong in the midfield, eh ?

This post has been edited by Ze Milanio: Jun 23 2006, 12:52 AM