Seven, An Aela & Ungarion Prequel Options

[haute ecole rider]

All through this story I had been wondering how you were going to end it. Would you stay faithful to the stories/movies that provided the inspiration? Or would you craft your own ending?

Yes, the Seven are now Five, but rightly so. So in that sense we depart from the movies' endings. But their stories continue from here, and it is up to us to imagine those stories.

I loved Seridwe's reference to hair products - it made me think of Buffy!

I have to say that I wasn't surprised by Talun-Lei's decision to stay. After all, that is what his counterpart (played by Horst Buchholz) in the Magnificent Seven did. Talun-Lei will have plenty of stories to tell his grandchildren!

I couldn't think of a better father for Ulpia's children than Valens. I also support her decision not to tell him. After all, she doesn't want to tie him down with obligations, either. It would only make things worse. Better to not tell him and let him pursue his own path. Though that might come back to cause regret in the future . . .

This has been a very satisfying story throughout, and I for one am both glad and sad that it is over. Perhaps we will see more of the Magnificent Five in the TF?

[King Coin]

No I have not seen the Seven Samurai. I suppose if I ever do, I’ll be thinking “they copied SubRosa!”

I love what they did with the monster’s shell.

Well, Ulpia sure had a surprise waiting.

Severus Snape! Sorry.

Talun-Lei! Smart move I think. He will find his place there.

Wonderful little story!

[Grits]

I absolutely loved this story. When I watch the movies I’ll be thinking That’s Dark-Eye and That’s Talun-Lei!

"Now that is the spirit!" Ungarion grinned and clapped a hand on the young Argonian's shoulder. "You first."

I love it!

Ulpia looked to Aela. The Breton could see the desperation in the Imperial's eyes, mixed in with all of the things they had left unsaid since Aela's vow to remain friends. But there was no time, as there never was, and all Aela could do was nod back at her.

This may be my favorite passage in the story. It made me cry every time I read it.


Oh my gosh Talun-Lei’s face! I was in a panic over Aela’s dire situation, and then events turned so quickly! What a battle!!


"Don't tell anyone it was a spear," the Altmer gasped.

Oh, please keep writing Ungarion! I’m going to miss him as much as Aela after this story!

That was an inspired touch to have the entire plan come down to the most basic Flare spell. All of the mages knew it but none had the magicka to cast! Yay scrolls, my most overlooked inventory item of all time!

Oh, Nashira! That’s what happens when you’re not at the Battle for Bruma. You die in the prequel! I would have to quote this whole episode to highlight my favorite part. Awesome.

Aela was not sure, but she wondered if the Imperial was blushing? There seemed to be more color in her cheeks than normal. Indeed, her entire visage seemed to bear a healthy glow which it had previously lacked.

Who knocked up Ulpia?! How wonderful to see that she found her courage. And Talun-Lei feeling conflicted right up until he changed his mind and splashed back to his water priestess was a very satisfying end.

My first memory of Seridwe was her intricate braids in the TF, so I grinned to hear her wish for hair products. I do hope to hear more of the fabulous five mercenaries from Bravil! What a wonderful story!!

[SubRosa]

No, no more story updates this time. Just some acknowledgments.


Acadian: Thank you for all of your support Acadian.

Talun-Lei's one-eyed resemblance to Dark-Eye was not in my outline. But once I decided to put that arrow through his eye, it did become intentional. I wanted to juxtapose the two, and how differently they turned out, in spite of sharing the same wound.


haute ecole rider: Thank you for your continued reading and comments, they helped a great deal through this rather ambitious story.

I did stay mostly true to the movies. Except that I did not kill over half the main characters! Even with Nashira's death, mine is the happy version.


King Coin: Thank you for always being here with your comments and ideas. I highly recommend The Seven Samurai and The Magnificent Seven. Both are excellent films.

I didn't get the name Severus from the Harry Potter books (I guess I should have seen it though). He was a member of an old RTW forum I used to habit, and I thought I would make an homage to him.


Grits: Thank you for always commenting and giving me another perspective on the story. It helps tremendously with making the characters and their interactions come alive in my mind.

That little part about all of those things left unsaid between Aela and Ulpia is something I did work on. And now I regret not going into more detail when they had their first almost encounter in Ulpia's house. It would have made their eventual lovemaking, and parting, more powerful. Not to mention a better juxtaposition with Talun-Lei and Meen-Sa. That is something I have a mind to fix.


Next up, I have a mind to do a lot of reworking of the story and perhaps submit it for publishing. That means taking out all of the ES elements, so a brand new world, new races, new names for many people, and even major overhauls of the some of the characters. I also don't want it to be as blatant a copy of the source material, so also a rewriting of some of the plot.

[McBadgere]

I'd buy it!!...Hell yeah!!...

This was a truly special story, that I loved from start to finish...

While I have to apologise for keep leaving it behind, that I had so much to read in one go was such an enjoyable "Problem" to have... ...

I know that letting all of the Seven off was never going to happen, but that so many lived to fight another day was nicely done...Well, I like that sort of thing, don't I?...And that leaves the possibility of a follow-up story, or at least an appearance by the others in something again...

I may, at times, go on too much about stuff... ...

But honest, this story deserves every word of whatever I've said about it....There, that makes perfect sense... ...

Aaaamywho...

Absolutely loved it...Thank you!...

So, for now...

Nice one!!...

*Stands to applaud most heartly from height...*...

[SubRosa]

Thank you very much for the comments McB, not just the last one, but all of them. I was holding out to see if anyone else might have something to add. Its an old habit from the official forums, where they lock the threads at 200 posts, so you want to make the most of every one you make.

I know what you mean about the enjoyable problem of having lots of posts to read at once, rather than doing it the once a week or later apart. On the one hand it can be kind of daunting to look at four or five pages that you have not read. But on the other, it is nice to read it all in one or two sittings, as you would a book. You can take more in that way, and you don't forget things that you read about two months earlier.

I did purposely leave it very open-ended, so I had plenty of room for a sequel with our Favorite Five adventurers from Bravil. Even Six is possible, since there are plenty of tropes that can bring Talun-Lei out of 'retirement' as well.

This post has been edited by SubRosa: Apr 24 2014, 01:57 AM

[SubRosa]

I had a few ideas for who would play everyone in the movie version.

Tom Hiddleston is my front-runner to play Ungarion. He has the quick wit, and a great sense of humor. Plus he can actually play nice people (I loved him in War Horse). He would just need some pointy ears and his hair dyed dark red. Besides, he has to be gay IRL. I mean look at him!

My original thought for Valens was Ioan Gruffad, but lately I am leaning more toward François Arnaud, after seeing him in season three of the Borgias. He is a little young, but he makes a great Black Prince.

Aela has eluded me for a long time. But now I am thinking Ellen Page. She has the spunk and hutzpah to play someone with a strong a will as Aela. At the same time she can do the soft and vulnerable side as well. And she has the wit to keep up with someone like Ungarion Hiddleston. Finally she is not too much of a girly girl. She would just have to dye her hair brown.

And of course Andy Serkis would do Talun-Lei. Well, he would do the motion capture. All of the Argonians would be cgi, I think. Come to think of it, he would be great as Dark-Eye as well. Maybe Chris Evans could do Talun-Lei. He can do that resolute "I'm going to make a difference" attitude down pat. That would leave Evil Andy all to Dark-Eye.

After seeing Katheryn Winnick in Vikings, I think she would be a great Seridwe. I mean, look at that hair.

This post has been edited by SubRosa: Jul 15 2014, 12:45 AM

[Acadian]

Fabulous choices all around!

I don't know any of those actors/actresses so I'm going by picture looks only. Not sure how to cast an Argonian.

[Grits]

Oh these are so perfect!

I couldn’t see the Ellen Page link, but I know exactly what she looks like. She’s adorable.

How funny, when I saw Lagertha’s hair in season two I immediately thought of Seridwe!

When I was reading the story I always pictured Ioan Gruffudd’s Lancelot as Valens. Of course he might be getting a little long in the tooth for Valens by now.

I’m especially delighted by Tom Hiddleston as Ungarion. He definitely has the all kinds of awesome that Ungarion requires.

These are great!

[SubRosa]

Fabulous choices all around!

I don't know any of those actors/actresses so I'm going by picture looks only. Not sure how to cast an Argonian.

You need to start watching some movies or tv shows! Vikings is quite good. Good enough that I bought both seasons on blu ray.

Tom Hiddleston is probably best known for playing Loki in the Thor/Avengers movies. But he can do more than just play a bad guy. He had an excellent turn in War Horse where he plays this really decent and cool English officer. That is what really turned me on to his acting skills. He also appears in the first few seasons of BBCs version of Wallander (starring Kenneth Branagh). There is also a ton of You Tube videos of him off screen, and he is very charming and funny. I love his impressions - especially of Chris Evans and velociraptors

Oh these are so perfect!

I couldn’t see the Ellen Page link, but I know exactly what she looks like. She’s adorable.

How funny, when I saw Lagertha’s hair in season two I immediately thought of Seridwe!

When I was reading the story I always pictured Ioan Gruffudd’s Lancelot as Valens. Of course he might be getting a little long in the tooth for Valens by now.

I’m especially delighted by Tom Hiddleston as Ungarion. He definitely has the all kinds of awesome that Ungarion requires.

These are great!

I fixed the Ellen Page link above. I am not sure what happened to the other one. Aela eluded me for a long time. I watched Inception again a few weeks ago, and that might be what put Ellen Page in my mind. Or maybe the new X-Men movie. I have loved her since Juno of course. She has just the right attitude, is the right age, she can be very likable, very sarcastic, come across as a bad ass, and at the same time make us all feel sorry for her when life takes a dump on her characters. Just what I need for Aela!

Tom Hiddleston is so Ungarion!

Ioan Gruffud was my original inspiration for Valens. I have a pic of him somewhere back there too from King Arthur, all in black armor. But he is getting a bit too old for the part these days. And then after that I saw Francois in Borgias, and was just blown away by his performance. He does an anti-hero so well. In spite of all the nasty things he does, we can still love him, because he can show us his side of things.

I am so in love with Kathryn Winnick after season two of Vikings. She is just Dayum! I want to see a show just about her!

This post has been edited by SubRosa: Jun 26 2014, 09:52 PM

[Destri Melarg]

CLICK

I hope you don’t mind one last comment!

When I first saw the title of this I thought you were doing an homage to the David Fincher flick starring Brad Pitt and Morgan Freeman. Then I saw that you were tackling Kurosawa. I think we spoke of the original vs. the hollywood version before (and the tv show, if I’m not mistaken). For my personal taste I always found Kurosawa’s version to be too ponderous for me, so I prefer the western (plus how can you resist Steve McQueen shaking those shotgun shells?).

Something I’ve noticed in your writing is the absence of the self-consciousness that the early parts of the TF possessed. You have become the complete master of your craft now, evidenced by your remarkable ability to let your characters have the stage.

Now onto the story itself:

Calvera Dark Eye entered the stage with the perfect amount of menace. I like how you’ve chosen to represent the Naga. I also like that we are in Black Marsh, a segment of Tamriel that has yet to be presented in any of the games.

Aela and Ungarion are a well matched pair. Where the Altmer is vain, the Breton is self conscious. You do an admirable job of communicating their different personalities from the moment they take over the story.

So where does one find people without ties who have the hunger for impossible odds without the promise of adequate compensation? At the tavern, of course! I already love Aela and Ungarion!

Nashira’s character intrigued me the moment I laid eyes ears upon her. How could she not, being a fellow Redguard and all? Plus she’s playing the laconic James Coburn roll, with a little bit of a wandering samurai feel. She also seems to be wearing the solids that mark her as a Crown (rather than Forebear stripes). That might be purely coincidence, however. But, with rumors of her being an Ansei, such a political affiliation only makes sense. I also have to admit that, like h.e.r, I found Seridwe to be a little too impressive. Chalk up another who has watched too many old martial arts movies!

Valens’ introduction came with a drastic new take on Azura’s Star. Your logic in changing the enchantment is sound. That was something that always bothered me as well. I just chalked it up to the fact that, no matter how much we may want her to be, Azura is not a goddess. She is still a Daedric Prince, and being such, she is not bound to the strict confines of morality that mortals adhere to. I am also of the opinion that anyone who decides to forever scar an entire race (one whom she professed to favor, no less) in a fit of pique should not be looked upon as completely benevolent.

Horst Buchholz Talun-Lei is exactly what I expected him to be, given the preponderance of Argonians in this story (which I love, btw. I wish I had more Argonians around in my own work!). I thought it interesting that he would be discouraged from joining by Valens of all people. I thought such discouragement might come from Aela, or perhaps Do’Sakhar. The choice of making it Valens gives him more depth as a character. Especially after he takes the young Argonian under his wing for the spear training sessions. Now he’s starting to remind me of Pappy from the TF!

I’m also left wondering if Talun-Lei’s race was chosen to make it easier for him to follow the boat!

And it seems that someone has followed in Scotti’s trail (from a research perspective that is). I just loved The Argonian Account!

“Now we are seven.”

Indeed!

The details you go into describing the village, people, and customs makes Agrigento a vivid setting in the reader’s mind. Too often details like that are overlooked, to the writer’s detriment. I especially liked the fact that it is Talun-Lei who teaches his comrades the proper customs surrounding soju.

And now, thanks to his interactions with the children, I discover that Do’Sakhar is the Charles Bronson of this homage. His death in the movie gets me every time! Now I am anticipating Calvera’s Dark Eye’s return with even more dread! Damn!

You have always been adept at filling those moments that constitute the calm before the proverbial storm. It is nice to see that some things don’t change. The anticipation is ramping up on this end of the monitor. Remembering your description of the Battle of Bruma fifty or so years ago (at least that’s how long it feels that I’ve been away ), I can’t wait to see what you have in store when the bandits finally return.

But, before that can happen, we have to establish the blossoming romance between Talun-Lei and Meen-Sa. The scene between the two was a simple one, but the subtext was thick enough to cut.

And, finally, it was nice to see the mercenaries (though I’m not sure that’s the right word for them anymore... protectors maybe? defenders?) feeding the children of the village (jambalaya too... to quote Acadian “Yum!”). Stalks’ comment about them being one was spot on!

Aela’s healing of the Naga scout highlights the best thing about having magic available as a tool in this world. You can get really creative in the means and applications for its use. It is rare when a writer is equally effective in scenes of action and character developement. It is even rarer when a writer can have character developement in an action scene. I’m still waiting for Do’Sakhar’s inevitable fall... and I find myself wondering who else will never leave Agrigento.

Okay, so far I’ve been reading a chapter... then adding a comment. I can’t do that anymore because Calvera Dark Eye has returned. I’ll be back to sum up my opinion of this terrific story you have weaved for us when I finish.

...

Okay, I’m back... and I’m angry! WHY OH WHY DID YOU HAVE TO KILL OFF NASHIRA?????!!!!!!! The only Redguard in the whole story and she has to die at the end! That reminds me of every horror movie cliche in hollywood!

Just kidding, ‘Rosa. The final battles were absolutely epic! I have nothing to say beyond the mountain of praise already heaped upon you for this great story except to say that I think Kurosawa would have been proud. Oh, and thanks for not killing off Do’Sakhar!

I can totally see Tom Hiddleston as Ungarion, and it's nice to see that someone else likes The Borgias as much as I do!

[SubRosa]

You had the same reaction to Nashira's death as Hautee I see! She had to die for a lot of reasons, not the least being that in the TF when Aela recounts the members of her old adventuring band, she never got mentioned. Except for Talun-Lei, the others had to survive, because I had already related their fates in the TF. Talun-Lei got to live because I wanted someone to balance out Nashira and her death. Where Nashira was a loner, a wanderer, who lived for her craft, Talun-Lei is the opposite. In spite of his dreams of martial adventure and fame, he takes the opposite route, of family and a quiet, settled life. I wanted to show one of the subtexts from the films: that the life of a ronin/gunman is an empty, lonely, and ultimately fatal road. Like nuclear war, the only way to win at it is not to play.

I think Ungarion and Aela make such a fine pair because as you noted, they are also opposites. I specifically developed Ungarion to be Aela's antithesis. Where she is quiet and introverted, he is outgoing and extroverted. She wants to just vanish in the crowd, he wants everyone to see him. She is pessimistic, expecting the worst because she is so used to getting it, where Ungarion is the eternal optimist. Aela lives with one foot in the spirit world at all times, where he is always completely down-to-Nirn, and so on.

This post has been edited by SubRosa: Oct 9 2014, 11:15 PM