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> ESO 2020 Discussion - The Dark Heart of Skyrim
RaderOfTheLostArk
post Jan 17 2020, 06:31 AM
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Alright, people. We've finally gotten a look at and quite a bit of information about the season-long story for ESO this year: The Dark Heart of Skyrim. This specific thread will be for discussion about it. What do you think about what ZOS had to say regarding this year's content during the live reveal? What confirmed content excites you the most? What are you hoping for or predicting will come out in terms of locations, monsters, dungeons, etc.? So on and so on.

And...discuss!


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mALX
post Jan 17 2020, 10:38 AM
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* I'll bet the quest DLC that drops in the second half of the year will involve the "Reachmen."

* The vampire revamp was hugely needed; I am glad they are fixing them! (or rather: hope the changes fixes them, lol).

* I am not as excited about this Chapter as I was about the last three; but they always do such a good job on the Chapters that I will probably pre-order the Collector's Edition anyway (want the "Arrow to the Knee" emote, laugh.gif )






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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 17 2020, 10:46 AM
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I’m very interested in this new chapter. Really hoping it involves the Reachfolk in some meaningful way rather than just more fodder for our characters to destroy.


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mALX
post Jan 17 2020, 07:24 PM
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QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 04:46 AM) *

I’m very interested in this new chapter. Really hoping it involves the Reachfolk in some meaningful way rather than just more fodder for our characters to destroy.



Agree 100%.






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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 17 2020, 07:40 PM
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QUOTE(mALX @ Jan 17 2020, 12:24 PM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 04:46 AM) *

I’m very interested in this new chapter. Really hoping it involves the Reachfolk in some meaningful way rather than just more fodder for our characters to destroy.



Agree 100%.

I mean, there has to be at least one Reach clan that isn’t compromised entirely of murderous psychopaths, right?

This post has been edited by TheCheshireKhajiit: Jan 17 2020, 07:41 PM


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Darkness Eternal
post Jan 17 2020, 08:26 PM
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QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 07:40 PM) *

QUOTE(mALX @ Jan 17 2020, 12:24 PM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 04:46 AM) *

I’m very interested in this new chapter. Really hoping it involves the Reachfolk in some meaningful way rather than just more fodder for our characters to destroy.



Agree 100%.

I mean, there has to be at least one Reach clan that isn’t compromised entirely of murderous psychopaths, right?

Maybe?

Most we’ve seen in lore from the time of ESO to Skyrim are a bunch of murderous wild-warriors, and given the fact that the Daedric Princes they serve range from Namira, Molag, and Hircine, there’s not much room for anything else.

I’m hoping to meet some less murderous ones, for sure.

Now what I’m hoping for this chapter? Lore. I really like the fact that we’re getting to meet new characters and familiar ones, too.

The new vampires are apparently not Volkihar but another clan entirely. Since Skyrim, I’ve wanted to know what other clans are out there. They’ve been mentioned indirectly a handful of times. Harkon and his people are prepping for the events of Dawnguard, which in my honest opinion, is a lot of prepping.

I’m also interested in seeing the conflict between clans. Apparently the Rivenspire crew is going to go against the vamp crew in Skyrim, and Lamae’s quest will be reworked, most likely to fit the vampire lord ultimate skill. They also pretty much confirmed the suspicion that vampire lord form is NOT exclusive to the Volkihar, but pure blooded vampires in general.

Blackreach is apparently very, very big!


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And yet I am, and live—like vapours tossed.
I long for scenes where man hath never trod
A place where woman never smiled or wept
There to abide with my Creator, God,
And sleep as I in childhood sweetly slept,
Untroubling and untroubled where I lie
The grass below—above the vaulted sky.”
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ghastley
post Jan 17 2020, 08:52 PM
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I'm a bit confused if the Blackreach in ESO is supposed to be the same cavern we had in TES V: Skyrim, or the latter was just part of a larger underground realm, cut off by that time. So ESO gets the potential for it to spread under other provinces?

I also haven't quite caught whether the vampires are in Blackreach, or somewhere else in the new zone. At least they're going to be consistent with the single-player versions. Morrowind had competing vampire clans, so they don't even need to be on the same side for consistency with that.

Reachfolk could be multiple factions too. In Skyrim, Madanach's group were friendly after you aided his escape, but all the others still attacked you. They're sort of just a sub-race of Breton.


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mALX
post Jan 17 2020, 09:27 PM
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QUOTE(ghastley @ Jan 17 2020, 02:52 PM) *

I'm a bit confused if the Blackreach in ESO is supposed to be the same cavern we had in TES V: Skyrim, or the latter was just part of a larger underground realm, cut off by that time. So ESO gets the potential for it to spread under other provinces?

I also haven't quite caught whether the vampires are in Blackreach, or somewhere else in the new zone. At least they're going to be consistent with the single-player versions. Morrowind had competing vampire clans, so they don't even need to be on the same side for consistency with that.

Reachfolk could be multiple factions too. In Skyrim, Madanach's group were friendly after you aided his escape, but all the others still attacked you. They're sort of just a sub-race of Breton.


They showed those vampire attacks on the surface (actually in daylight) before they showed us the parts about Blackreach; so = probably will be both above and below ground.

I really hoped when they did the vampire fixes that they would reinstate the "Not in Daylight" thing like they had in Oblivion.

Oh, and kind of on topic: I was wondering how well they handled the changes they made in the Werewolf skill line a little over a year ago; does anyone know? And did they keep those changes or nerf them down shortly after making them?

That might be an indication on how they will be doing the changes for the vampires.

And: (other than what Gina said; that they will be reversing how they have it now as far as feeding making you a stronger vampire or weaker one) = does anyone have any idea what the new skills will be? Because that vampire in the vid was moving VERY fast; and turning into a raven.






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RaderOfTheLostArk
post Jan 17 2020, 09:53 PM
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Well, so much for the hope for a non-world-threatening scenario, lol: https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/up...hapter/greymoor

QUOTE
Stop a powerful Vampire Lord from enslaving Tamriel in the Dark Heart of Skyrim, a gothic tale of sinister secrets and deadly betrayals. The Elder Scrolls Online: Greymoor is the next stage in the epic story that begins with the Harrowstorm DLC and continues throughout the entire year.


I mean, that won't stop me from getting the story by any means and I'll keep an open mind, but Ysmir's Beard, another plan of a continent-wide cataclysmic proportion? Really? We don't need to save the world every time. And really, how many times can one character save the world in a span of a couple or so years?

As for the vampires, I hope we get an in-depth look at multiple vampire clans. Clans that hate each other and think they are superior to the others, and actively oppose each other. It's not often you get that in stories in general. And if you have a vampire character, there'd have to be something about you that the main antagonists would scoff at. Maybe they see you as thin-blooded or something like that. Given that this is an MMO, I don't see how they could give you the option of siding with the antagonists, unlike in Skyrim's Dawnguard expansion. I wonder if there will be any references to Volkihar clan in this expansion though? I'm glad ZOS isn't shoehorning them in since it wouldn't make any sense lore-wise.

As for Reachmen...well, when are they NOT murderous psychopaths? Lol. I mean, I'm sure there's got to be some of them that are much more reasonable, though. Maybe it has just been a characterization issue. Besides somewhat of an exception of Madanach's crew in TESV, they are pretty hegemonically and straightforwardly evil. ZOS confirmed that one of the later DLCs will involve them, so I suppose it will be a while before we get more info on that.

Regarding Blackreach, it is the same as what was in TESV, but we will see even more of it. So big it is supposed to be its own zone (although I don't know if I am a fan of its potential to be under all of Tamriel). Maybe there will be some story bits that suggest why we can't go to these new areas in the time of TESV, but it could just as likely be more of a technical and artistic choice for ZOS to expand it.

EDIT: Oh, and I am all for the more gothic tone of this chapter. Nice change of pace from previous chapters in that regard, at least.

This post has been edited by RaderOfTheLostArk: Jan 17 2020, 09:56 PM


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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 17 2020, 10:05 PM
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QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Jan 17 2020, 01:26 PM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 07:40 PM) *

QUOTE(mALX @ Jan 17 2020, 12:24 PM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 04:46 AM) *

I’m very interested in this new chapter. Really hoping it involves the Reachfolk in some meaningful way rather than just more fodder for our characters to destroy.



Agree 100%.

I mean, there has to be at least one Reach clan that isn’t compromised entirely of murderous psychopaths, right?

Maybe?

Most we’ve seen in lore from the time of ESO to Skyrim are a bunch of murderous wild-warriors, and given the fact that the Daedric Princes they serve range from Namira, Molag, and Hircine, there’s not much room for anything else.

I’m hoping to meet some less murderous ones, for sure.

I feel that they could easily do a... I won’t say friendly, but a less hostile Reach clan that worships Hircine. I’ve never really felt that Hircine is evil, especially when compared to the likes of Bal. Likewise his worshippers wouldn’t have to attack people on sight.


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"Family is an odd thing, is it not? Defined by blood, separated by blood, joined by blood. In the end, it's all just blood."
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Darkness Eternal
post Jan 17 2020, 11:45 PM
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QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 10:05 PM) *

QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Jan 17 2020, 01:26 PM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 07:40 PM) *

QUOTE(mALX @ Jan 17 2020, 12:24 PM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 17 2020, 04:46 AM) *

I’m very interested in this new chapter. Really hoping it involves the Reachfolk in some meaningful way rather than just more fodder for our characters to destroy.



Agree 100%.

I mean, there has to be at least one Reach clan that isn’t compromised entirely of murderous psychopaths, right?

Maybe?

Most we’ve seen in lore from the time of ESO to Skyrim are a bunch of murderous wild-warriors, and given the fact that the Daedric Princes they serve range from Namira, Molag, and Hircine, there’s not much room for anything else.

I’m hoping to meet some less murderous ones, for sure.

I feel that they could easily do a... I won’t say friendly, but a less hostile Reach clan that worships Hircine. I’ve never really felt that Hircine is evil, especially when compared to the likes of Bal. Likewise his worshippers wouldn’t have to attack people on sight.
The thing about Daedric Princes in general is that they often have more than one aspect to them, and the same goes for their followers. The Glenmoril Wyrd venerate the nature side to Hircine, while the Reachmen value his feral side and champion violence through hunting for sport. It really depends on the clan to be honest.


--------------------
And yet I am, and live—like vapours tossed.
I long for scenes where man hath never trod
A place where woman never smiled or wept
There to abide with my Creator, God,
And sleep as I in childhood sweetly slept,
Untroubling and untroubled where I lie
The grass below—above the vaulted sky.”
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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 18 2020, 12:44 AM
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QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Jan 17 2020, 04:45 PM) *

The thing about Daedric Princes in general is that they often have more than one aspect to them, and the same goes for their followers. The Glenmoril Wyrd venerate the nature side to Hircine, while the Reachmen value his feral side and champion violence through hunting for sport. It really depends on the clan to be honest.

Very true.

This post has been edited by TheCheshireKhajiit: Jan 18 2020, 12:45 AM


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Darkness Eternal
post Jan 18 2020, 01:55 AM
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QUOTE(RaderOfTheLostArk @ Jan 17 2020, 09:53 PM) *

Well, so much for the hope for a non-world-threatening scenario, lol: https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/up...hapter/greymoor

QUOTE
Stop a powerful Vampire Lord from enslaving Tamriel in the Dark Heart of Skyrim, a gothic tale of sinister secrets and deadly betrayals. The Elder Scrolls Online: Greymoor is the next stage in the epic story that begins with the Harrowstorm DLC and continues throughout the entire year.


I mean, that won't stop me from getting the story by any means and I'll keep an open mind, but Ysmir's Beard, another plan of a continent-wide cataclysmic proportion? Really? We don't need to save the world every time. And really, how many times can one character save the world in a span of a couple or so years?

As for the vampires, I hope we get an in-depth look at multiple vampire clans. Clans that hate each other and think they are superior to the others, and actively oppose each other. It's not often you get that in stories in general. And if you have a vampire character, there'd have to be something about you that the main antagonists would scoff at. Maybe they see you as thin-blooded or something like that. Given that this is an MMO, I don't see how they could give you the option of siding with the antagonists, unlike in Skyrim's Dawnguard expansion. I wonder if there will be any references to Volkihar clan in this expansion though? I'm glad ZOS isn't shoehorning them in since it wouldn't make any sense lore-wise.



I think we’ll see more than a single vampire clan. It’s been mentioned that House Ravenwatch group is gonna help the player defeat the vampires in Skyrim, and that the Volkihar won’t be the main vampire menace. Harkon is out doing his thing and the ones we face are a different type.


--------------------
And yet I am, and live—like vapours tossed.
I long for scenes where man hath never trod
A place where woman never smiled or wept
There to abide with my Creator, God,
And sleep as I in childhood sweetly slept,
Untroubling and untroubled where I lie
The grass below—above the vaulted sky.”
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mALX
post Jan 18 2020, 07:25 PM
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QUOTE(RaderOfTheLostArk @ Jan 17 2020, 03:53 PM) *

Well, so much for the hope for a non-world-threatening scenario, lol: https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/up...hapter/greymoor

QUOTE
Stop a powerful Vampire Lord from enslaving Tamriel in the Dark Heart of Skyrim, a gothic tale of sinister secrets and deadly betrayals. The Elder Scrolls Online: Greymoor is the next stage in the epic story that begins with the Harrowstorm DLC and continues throughout the entire year.


I mean, that won't stop me from getting the story by any means and I'll keep an open mind, but Ysmir's Beard, another plan of a continent-wide cataclysmic proportion? Really? We don't need to save the world every time. And really, how many times can one character save the world in a span of a couple or so years?

As for the vampires, I hope we get an in-depth look at multiple vampire clans. Clans that hate each other and think they are superior to the others, and actively oppose each other. It's not often you get that in stories in general. And if you have a vampire character, there'd have to be something about you that the main antagonists would scoff at. Maybe they see you as thin-blooded or something like that. Given that this is an MMO, I don't see how they could give you the option of siding with the antagonists, unlike in Skyrim's Dawnguard expansion. I wonder if there will be any references to Volkihar clan in this expansion though? I'm glad ZOS isn't shoehorning them in since it wouldn't make any sense lore-wise.

As for Reachmen...well, when are they NOT murderous psychopaths? Lol. I mean, I'm sure there's got to be some of them that are much more reasonable, though. Maybe it has just been a characterization issue. Besides somewhat of an exception of Madanach's crew in TESV, they are pretty hegemonically and straightforwardly evil. ZOS confirmed that one of the later DLCs will involve them, so I suppose it will be a while before we get more info on that.

Regarding Blackreach, it is the same as what was in TESV, but we will see even more of it. So big it is supposed to be its own zone (although I don't know if I am a fan of its potential to be under all of Tamriel). Maybe there will be some story bits that suggest why we can't go to these new areas in the time of TESV, but it could just as likely be more of a technical and artistic choice for ZOS to expand it.

EDIT: Oh, and I am all for the more gothic tone of this chapter. Nice change of pace from previous chapters in that regard, at least.


Agree with most of this; but I am with Khajiit in wanting to have at least one quest that gives us a side of the Reachmen other than the psychotic killers. (like they did with the Ashlanders in Stonefalls; that one tribe of Foresworn in Skyrim; and the Great Khan in New Vegas; etc).










QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Jan 17 2020, 07:55 PM) *

QUOTE(RaderOfTheLostArk @ Jan 17 2020, 09:53 PM) *

Well, so much for the hope for a non-world-threatening scenario, lol: https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/up...hapter/greymoor

QUOTE
Stop a powerful Vampire Lord from enslaving Tamriel in the Dark Heart of Skyrim, a gothic tale of sinister secrets and deadly betrayals. The Elder Scrolls Online: Greymoor is the next stage in the epic story that begins with the Harrowstorm DLC and continues throughout the entire year.


I mean, that won't stop me from getting the story by any means and I'll keep an open mind, but Ysmir's Beard, another plan of a continent-wide cataclysmic proportion? Really? We don't need to save the world every time. And really, how many times can one character save the world in a span of a couple or so years?

As for the vampires, I hope we get an in-depth look at multiple vampire clans. Clans that hate each other and think they are superior to the others, and actively oppose each other. It's not often you get that in stories in general. And if you have a vampire character, there'd have to be something about you that the main antagonists would scoff at. Maybe they see you as thin-blooded or something like that. Given that this is an MMO, I don't see how they could give you the option of siding with the antagonists, unlike in Skyrim's Dawnguard expansion. I wonder if there will be any references to Volkihar clan in this expansion though? I'm glad ZOS isn't shoehorning them in since it wouldn't make any sense lore-wise.



I think we’ll see more than a single vampire clan. It’s been mentioned that House Ravenwatch group is gonna help the player defeat the vampires in Skyrim, and that the Volkihar won’t be the main vampire menace. Harkon is out doing his thing and the ones we face are a different type.


I really enjoyed that Ravenwatch Clan questline; so I do look forward to them coming back.






This post has been edited by mALX: Jan 18 2020, 07:19 PM


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Grits
post Jan 18 2020, 08:37 PM
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I loved the House Ravenwatch quests. Those are some of my favorite NPCs in ESO. Super happy to hear they will have more to do in the new chapter.

Since the Skyrim game’s Forsworn were a product of Forth Era events, maybe the ESO Reachfolk will be era-appropriate. Even in the Skyrim game not all of The Reach’s natives were Forsworn. So I have some hope that ESO’s Reachfolk won’t all be tribal and hostile.


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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 19 2020, 02:22 PM
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The Forsworn are not simply murdering psychopaths. They are freedom fighters struggling against centuries of Nordish oppression.


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Darkness Eternal
post Jan 19 2020, 03:47 PM
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QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 19 2020, 02:22 PM) *

The Forsworn are not simply murdering psychopaths. They are freedom fighters struggling against centuries of Nordish oppression.

From a certain point of view, huh? tongue.gif


--------------------
And yet I am, and live—like vapours tossed.
I long for scenes where man hath never trod
A place where woman never smiled or wept
There to abide with my Creator, God,
And sleep as I in childhood sweetly slept,
Untroubling and untroubled where I lie
The grass below—above the vaulted sky.”
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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 20 2020, 01:50 AM
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QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Jan 19 2020, 08:47 AM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 19 2020, 02:22 PM) *

The Forsworn are not simply murdering psychopaths. They are freedom fighters struggling against centuries of Nordish oppression.

From a certain point of view, huh? tongue.gif

I mean, I guess, it really just depends on if you accept Madanach’s story as truth. He didn’t really seem to have any reason to lie about any of it, in my opinion. The treachery of the Nords in the Reach was on full display. Look how they treated Ulfrich the instant he became inconvenient for them.


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RaderOfTheLostArk
post Jan 20 2020, 12:55 PM
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QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 19 2020, 07:50 PM) *

QUOTE(Darkness Eternal @ Jan 19 2020, 08:47 AM) *

QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Jan 19 2020, 02:22 PM) *

The Forsworn are not simply murdering psychopaths. They are freedom fighters struggling against centuries of Nordish oppression.

From a certain point of view, huh? tongue.gif

I mean, I guess, it really just depends on if you accept Madanach’s story as truth. He didn’t really seem to have any reason to lie about any of it, in my opinion. The treachery of the Nords in the Reach was on full display. Look how they treated Ulfrich the instant he became inconvenient for them.


I think that there are some legitimate grievances...but their responses are mostly unjustified and seriously damage their credibility. Murdering a whole bunch of people that were not responsible for taking your homeland (if we assume it was theirs to begin with) isn't the way to gain sympathy for your plight.

That's the way I see it, at least.


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TheCheshireKhajiit
post Jan 20 2020, 09:50 PM
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QUOTE(RaderOfTheLostArk @ Jan 20 2020, 05:55 AM) *

I think that there are some legitimate grievances...but their responses are mostly unjustified and seriously damage their credibility. Murdering a whole bunch of people that were not responsible for taking your homeland (if we assume it was theirs to begin with) isn't the way to gain sympathy for your plight.

That's the way I see it, at least.

Keep in mind, a lot of the murders and raids carried out by the Forsworn were ordered by the Silverbloods and were politically and financially motivated.

This post has been edited by TheCheshireKhajiit: Jan 20 2020, 09:57 PM


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