Chorrol Parliament, Be civil please.. Options

[milanius]

Ahh China... you would be suprised how much money they have. People are poor, but the country itself has loads of it. That's bacause they don't aknowledge yuan how much it's really worth, and because people work for rediculusly small amount of money. A lot of rich American\European companies already switched their buisness from America\Europe to China.

They have the foundings, they have the extraordinary war equipment, and they have a lot of young men, capable of serving the army. Indeed, what could posably stop them? Forget about the NATO and USA: China has nuclear weapons and great armory, so they won't dare to start a ''peace mission''.

I dare not imagine what could happen

My dear lads, China isn't going to act up with its nuclear arsenal or do anything equitably stupid... why, you ask ? Well, you've given the answer yourselves. It is not in their best interest to do so. Tell me, how long has it been that you couldn't buy a pair of Nike shoes made in any other place except China ? And how many times have you turned the product label only to see those horrifying 3 words: "Made in China" ?? The Chinese won't go into some bizzare full-blown confrontation with the rest of 'us', especially now that we now have a multipolar world (more than 2-3 serious nuclear powers) - no, they will continue to undermine the entire world's economy and strenghten their economical reserves, even if that might just blow up in their faces... now, THAT is what truly scares the juggling cats out of me

[HyPN0]

milanius, we were talking in theory
And I mentioned nukes, just for a reason that no other world country would interfiere with the war betwen China and some other Asian country. Just knowing that if you attack them, you could risk a nuclear disaster, you would think twice before attacking.

But even if they attack some poor other country: What would stop them? Nothing.

[Foster]

You've got to understand the Chinese mindset. It's not about money, it's about prestige. It's about their concept of face. Face is, in my experience, THE most important thing in Chinese culture. Loss of face can be worse than death.

Quite simply, the Chinese are quite capable of turning a war nuclear if it means that they preserve their honour.

What you've got to realise is that the Taiwan thing isn't so much about the economy, or even the unity (though that is a lovely chunk). The cultural revolution pretty much squished out all of Chinese culture, and I'm talking about stuff going back to the Qin dynasty. Now, Chang Kai-Shek realised that the communists were going to pretty much wipe the place clean, and so took most of China's national treasures with him. What they have in Beijing is incredible; but not even a fraction of it. If you want to see the impressive collection, go to the museum in Taiwan.

This is why China has made sure that Taiwan isn't recognised as a country (by most places), doesn't call itself China in the Olympics, and, most important of all, why they've issued a statement that they WILL re-unify with Taiwan - by political means, but if that doesn't fail, they will use force. They've said it, loud and clear.

[HyPN0]

This is why China has made sure that Taiwan isn't recognised as a country (by most places), doesn't call itself China in the Olympics, and, most important of all, why they've issued a statement that they WILL re-unify with Taiwan - by political means, but if that doesn't fail, they will use force. They've said it, loud and clear.

Hmm, I didn't hear anything about it, but I don't watch the news lately
Still, I don't think they will use nuclear weapon. They have a strong army, why would they use WMD? But I think they will do it peacefuly.

Anyway, since you were living in Hong Kong (right?), you would certanly know this better than me.
What do you think will come of it?

[Neela]

I am not too worried about China actually. Sure they have a billion or so people, but they would have a hard time fielding an army for any major conflict. If sanctions were ever brought against China, their economy would collapse is a short amount of time. As was said alot of stuff is made in China and that direct flow of funds is not something they would want to stifle carelessly.

Besides, the most insidious of all weapons is already installed in China. McDonald's!

Now country can long stand against the Big Mac w/cheese!

[milanius]

milanius, we were talking in theory
And I mentioned nukes, just for a reason that no other world country would interfiere with the war betwen China and some other Asian country. Just knowing that if you attack them, you could risk a nuclear disaster, you would think twice before attacking.

But even if they attack some poor other country: What would stop them? Nothing.

Meh, theory shmeory when I see all these chinese stores, stacked up in certain parts of Nis, with the tendence of rising into entire Chinatown, I shudder. Chinese are far more dangerous as a conquoring force that does the job slowly, but inevitably, rather that a nuclear superpower. And their work etics suplement them perfectly - they'll run down european economies, I fear, faster that you can say "Weapons of Mass Destruction".

[Foster]

Hmm, I didn't hear anything about it, but I don't watch the news lately 
Still, I don't think they will use nuclear weapon. They have a strong army, why would they use WMD? But I think they will do it peacefuly.

Anyway, since you were living in Hong Kong (right?), you would certanly know this better than me.

Oh, this isn't news - China said that a few years ago. The panda thing is recent. It's a great diplomatic gesture to be offered a Panda by China - really a nasty problem for Taiwan though; do they accept it or not?

Personally, I think that China is unlikely to do anything with a US carrier group in range. However, should there be a window of oppotunity (or a deal made), I think that an invasion is likey. WMDs? Nope. Can't see them using it, because of collateral damage. They're claiming unification; it doesn't go down well to blast the crap out of those you are supposedly joining with.

China works in decades, rather than years. It's been moving peices for a long time now, and I think that Taiwan has a very short life expectancy, at least as it is known now. Either they'll join diplomatically, or they'll join by force. Either way, my guess would be that China will establish another SAR, similar to what they've done in Hong Kong.

By the by (this is completely unrelated) but I was trying to find a site that explains Taiwan's international status. Whilst I fell short somewhat, I'm muchos enjoying the CIA factbook (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/tw.html) as it has very detailed information on all countries. Note Taiwan is at the bottom of the list, next to the EU, due to it's unique international status.

[Channler]

China will never go to war with the US or the EU. Foster said it perfectly. You wanna see lots of ruined economies? Get of China. But its mutual, we need them, and they need us. I think we should all hold hands and sing kumbyeya!

[gamer10]

They've got India pegged in by Pakistan,

Lets hope the situation doesn't escalate, if it leads right down to it, US foreign policy in the matter would be torn two ways should a serious war erupt. Pakistan is considered a key ally, but the recent nuclear agreement between the US and India has partially severed US support for Pakistan.

However, in a conventional war, Indias armed forces are widley considered far superior (I'm talking India and Pakistan, not India and China), but in a nuclear war the effects would be overwhelming and devastating for both nations.

A war with China, whether its the United States or India, would go bad for either of the two latter nations. This is only if they stood alone, but when it comes down to it, US support in a war, if the agressor was China, would probably tilt in India's favor.

This post has been edited by gamer10: May 28 2006, 05:40 AM

[HyPN0]

I think that I was misunderstood....
Guys, I wasn't saying that China would attack USA. I was saying that if USA intrefiers with China operations in say, Taiwan, who knows how would China react. USA would not risk a nuclear war. That's why nobody will even try to make a ''peace mission''

[Channler]

I think that I was misunderstood....
Guys, I wasn't saying that China would attack USA. I was saying that if USA intrefiers with China operations in say, Taiwan, who knows how would China react. USA would not risk a nuclear war. That's why nobody will even try to make a ''peace mission''

If I'm not mistaken we've cut off.. in 1970 diplomatic ties with Tiwain, now yes we still get alot of electronic stuff from there but it would ruin their economy not to sell to us or the rest of the world. And generally our government has been for the reunification of Taiwan and China. I'm for it as long as China doesn't fuxxerz everything up and try to purge all the ancient culture that has been preserved (if only through museums.)

Someone said something along the lines of this..

The 20th century was an age of America and General Motors, the 21st sentury will be that of Asia and Honda.

To true.. I'm not going to fight it.. But my question is how long? Cheap labor will only exist in nations that 1) are underdeveloped, 2) Oppresive governments, 3) hire immigrants at unfair wages.

I'm afriad of what is going to happen when Afrika starts to modernize. Good for them yes, but what happens after "equality" is reached? Watch prices for everything sky-rocket. You wanna see a Super Depression? It's comming.

All of this is the sole opinion of Nick Inc.

[HyPN0]

Hmm, very intresting post Clannler, and might be easily true.

Anyway, I would like to ask some of you Americans, here on the forum: Is all the USA police like this?
Or is this just an extreme case?

[Megil Tel-Zeke]

I would have to say that is a pretty extreme case. most policemen I've known are nice and decent people.

[Dantrag]

Yeah, you don't see that stuff very often.

[HyPN0]

Ahh good. Glad to hear that.
How corrupted is the police in the states anyway? Will a policeman take a bribe if offered?

[Intestinal Chaos]

Ahh good. Glad to hear that.
How corrupted is the police in the states anyway? Will a policeman take a bribe if offered?

It really all depends on the person, but in most cases no. A had a close friend who's father is a policeman and a pothead. He took bribes of bud from people he caught for possession.

[Neela]

That would be a very extreme case indeed. The vast majority of police officers are all really decent people who are doing a difficult job. Of course some corruption does exist.. especially in larger cities where its difficult to keep tabs on all the officers. I wouldn't ever recommend bribing an officer here. You probably have less than 1 in 10 chance that they would take it, and the other 9 out of 10 times you just guaranteed yourself some jail time.

Overall I would trust the police here to do the right thing 99% of the time. Living in an age of camera phones and video keeps even the bad ones honest most of the time. Most police vehicles require video cameras mounted in them as well.

[Channler]

All our police officers are vietnam vets.. like the chief is ex-special forces..

And also no, I have never, prob will never know any people as sick as that. It takes a person who loves torture to do those disgusting things.

This post has been edited by Channler: May 29 2006, 02:39 AM

[DoomedOne]

Since as far as I can tell my last post was deleted I've determined the parliament is no longer a legitimate place for discussion or debate, and will no longer be positing here unless I get a suitable explanation. It probably doesn't mean anything to any of you, but I know what was in that post and it was completely inoffensive in a debate manner.

[Ibis]

Wow Doom, your post got deleted with no explanation? That does sound strange. Usually there is an admin note on what's going on if there's an edit or something.

That is an extreme case of police sadism and corruption. Perhaps they had something else against this guy as well, maybe of a personal nature.
I grew up actually, in a small New Jersey suburb with a very corrupt police force, but even they followed rules and kept the corruption secret from the law abiding citizens until the whole organized crime thing came out in the papers. I remember driving down the road one day and hearing the story of their wholesale arrest on the radio & thinking "Oh boy, now I can speed!" But it was pretty par for the course for NJ.